Author Topic: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"  (Read 949 times)

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Offline flatpack

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Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« on: December 22, 2017, 08:34:55 AM »
!This is for the Apartment Life/Ultimate Collection version of Inteen!

Hello!

I'm not to sure where to put this, but I'll also link you to the other thread on MTS here.

Both the OP and myself were having autonomy issues with the newspaper and the computer. "Search for Roommate" was now a very attractive thing for sims on apartments, and on one occasion, a sim in my game looked for a job autonomously. The OP narrowed it down to the Inteen B package. Changing the load order didn't help, and it was still happening without any other mods or CC.

I opened the package and found that the autonomy for "Search for Roommate" was set to 32, the same as "Read". I upped the value (to overkill levels, 128, just in case) and now the problem seems to be fixed. The thread I linked to has the file I edited, I'll double-checked the rules and post it on here if I can.

Just posting in case anyone else has the same issue, neither of us could find any thread or anything on here about it.

Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2017, 10:05:18 PM »
Hello flatpack,

Thank you for the link and your detailed analysis. You are correct that "Search for Roommate" is an autonomous behavior. However, this is not a change that the InTeenimater introduced. This is by Maxis' design and the autonomy level of 0x32 is the way this particular interaction (as well as Read) is tuned.

Autonomy mechanics can be fairly complex, and this particular knob is but one of several. There are a number of reasons that a sim can become "obsessed" or "fixated" with a particular behavior or activity (i.e. the "kicky ball" from FT).

It's possible that the OP had a mod/fix which reduces (or eliminates) the autonomous attractiveness of this action. Such a mod would conflict directly with InTeen and cause bizarre phenomena when using the computer or newspaper. The OP's seems to be exhibiting problems indicative of mod conflict.

So while it is admittedly a bit strange that "Search for Roommate" is branded an autonomous behavior in the TTAB resource you pointed out, it's not autonomous *because* of InTeen. It's just the way Maxis coded that interaction up. Your suggested modification to the TTAB is one potential means of disabling the autonomous appeal of this action (0x64 should do it) without mod conflict.

Lastly, if you are running the AL/UC version of InTeen, your package filenames should all begin with "zzz" (i.e. zzzInTeenimater_B.package), so you might want to be certain you have the latest version.

Cheers,

J
« Last Edit: December 28, 2017, 10:10:46 PM by jase439 »

Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2017, 04:32:12 AM »
I'm the OP in the MTS thread. I worked a long time to find the problem with the incessant search for roommates. And I mean incessant. Every time the sims finished searching for a roommate he started another search. And wouldnt stop. When I ONLY had inteen B in the downloads folder, i had the problem. When I removed it and added back my other hacks, no problem at all. And no problem with the new package by flatpack either.  So I am sure it is inteen B. I have the correct (latest) version correctly installed. I can't see how the game can be programmed to find a roommate this obsessively.

Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2017, 05:46:51 AM »
Hi VA,

Happy holidays and welcome to the forums.

A few questions:

1. There are two different releases of InTeenimater for AL/UC. Do you have MadCat's InTeen installed or the newest one posted here dated 24 Oct 2017? Additionally, you can examine the names of your InTeenimater package files; the newest version's files all begin with "zzz" - MadCat's does not. You can also click on a sim and choose InTeenimater | Version... Please report back as to which version you are running.

2. Are you running Sims Ultimate Collection or a standard retail install with the Apartment Life expansion pack? Do you have the Fun with Pets Stuff Pack?

3. What, if any, InTeenimater Flavor Paks do you currently have installed?

4. Are you experiencing any kind of "resets" or "jumps" when your Sim(s) perform this action (or anything else related to the newspaper or computer)?

5. Can you provide details about the family (which town, lot, apartment, # of sims, ages, etc.) where you are experiencing this issue?

Quote from: virtualalex
I can't see how the game can be programmed to find a roommate this obsessively.

You'd be surprised.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2017, 07:36:52 AM by jase439 »

Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2017, 03:30:34 AM »
Hi Jase

1. I have the zzz inteen installed.
2. Sims Ultimate Collection kindly gifted by EA.
3. Back to school, No Adult teens, No Age of Consent
4. No jumps related to newspaper actions, though I have noticed jumps with all members of one family (but not the people living in the apartment where I noticed the problem). Jumps stopped when I got them to do other actions but sometimes they still jumped.  Family now grown and dispersed. I havent yet noticed jumps in other families.

5. The problem with the roommates occurred in a custom town, custom apartment made by me, with the Maxis Cooke guy moved in. He was new, so beginning of adulthood. Lived alone (obviously didnt want to!). Havent had the problem since using flatpack's package B.

I am still getting the odd jump in other families (all custom - hate those Maxis folk!) and I havent identified the problem yet. I've put all the hacks which HCDU says may be a problem with inteen B in a separate folder but still in the game, in case I need to access them. Research into jumps still ongoing, but tbh, I'm ignoring them for the most part as I have stories to tell!


Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2017, 07:03:20 AM »
Thanks for the additional info, VA. A couple things worth noting:

Unrelated to this issue, you should not remove or relocate JUST the zzzInTeenimater_B.package file by itself. With the exception of package G (which lives in his own little world), ALL the InTeenimater package files should move together as a matched set - especially if you have flavor paks installed. Moving or removing JUST the B package is going to create unhappiness for you - guaranteed. Don't do that :)

The occasional jump bugs you are experiencing may contain meaningful clue(s) as to what packages may be in conflict (HCDU is really good but it's not perfect at finding certain indirect sources of mod conflict). Let's turn on testing cheats (boolprop testingcheatsenabled true) for now. When you experience a jump bug, choose Reset from the pop up. Note the time the jump bug occurred and then find the corresponding error log in your Logs folder and attach to a post here.

I was able to create a condition similar to what you describe playing the Riley family in Belladona Cove (1 adult + 1 child). Autonomous election of the Search for Roommate interaction appears to  be keyed off the sim's social motive. When the social need is met, the adult sim would select social behaviors more or less "at random". As I drove the the social motive down, the sim became increasingly more obsessed with searching for a roommate (either by newspaper or by computer). Raising the social motive appears to quell the behavior. With testing cheats enabled you should be able to experiment with this also by dragging the social motive meter up and down and seeing how this affects autonomous selection (obsession) of Search for Roommate. You will, of course, need to NOT use flatpack's modification which completely eliminates this interaction from any autonomous consideration. That said there does seem to be an unnatural preference for this autonomous behavior when the social motive is low which suggests a possible issue with the advertising tunings (which could be Maxis or a mod or both).

I will experiment with this a bit more running w/ and w/o InTeen and also running the flavor pak combination you have selected to see if I can observe any appreciable difference in how "strongly"  this behavior is favored when the sim's social motive is low (low as in "orange" or "red"). In the absence of another sim (or other social outlet) with which to interact, it would be understandable why Search for Roommate might be an attractive choice for a sim trying to resolve a low social motive score.

Perhaps you can try a similar experiment on your end to see how social motive score impacts the obsessiveness by which this interaction is selected. Also, collect any logs from jump bugs as mentioned previously.

Cheers,

J

UPDATE 1: Here's a few more observations. With no mods installed at all in the game, I can create scenarios where a single adult sim becomes preoccupied with finding a roommate (esp. if sitting at a computer). I think this interaction, in particular, is very noticeable (compared to others) in that it triggers a giant popup dialog that interrupts the normal flow of play so you may be more aware of it occurring than others. Also, (in addition to the critical social motive score), I noted that if all motives are relatively balanced (in the green with relatively comparable scores), Search for Roommate seems to receive preferential treatment compared to other activities. Again, this suggests an issue with the tunings, but they would be standard Maxis tunings as they appear to be elevated in the absence of any mods. I was also able to create a similar autonomous behavior loop with the sim wanting to practice piano obsessively.

UPDATE 2: I think I found something in the motive tunings for this behavior that may be exacerbating the "nomination" of this behavior. Stay tuned.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2017, 01:22:50 PM by jase439 »

Offline BoilingOil

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2017, 04:30:37 PM »
Instead of noting the time of the jump bug, one could also read the file name of the error log from the notification popup. I find that to be a faster and more accurate method of identifying the correct log.

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Offline zephyrzodiac

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2017, 08:23:11 PM »
If the files highlighted by the HCDU are still in the game, in a separate folder, how can you be sure they are not causing the problem with Inteen B rather than vice versa?
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Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2017, 09:02:22 PM »
Instead of noting the time of the jump bug, one could also read the file name of the error log from the notification popup. I find that to be a faster and more accurate method of identifying the correct log.
Definitely the most accurate way to go about it, but my memory isn't that good and I'm oft too lazy to write it down, so I just note the approximate time and find it that way.

Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2018, 11:45:24 AM »
So, after some futzing with this there doesn't seem to be any particular bug to fix here that will remedy what is simply a maxis annoyance. With or without InTeen single adult sims will seek out roommates to fill a social need (even if the social need is not critical...although a low social motive will make it all that more obsessive). You can continue using flatpack's tweak which will just disable autonomy or I can perhaps give you a standalone package which does the same without modifying InTeen. I'm not going to change InTeen to disable a behavior that maxis introduced however as this is outside the scope and overall theme of the mod. Whatever the case, this is not a "bug"...just one of many many annoyances caused by bad tuning and game balancing.

J

Offline zephyrzodiac

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2018, 12:50:00 PM »
Like the ballet barre and visitors....
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Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2018, 10:53:08 PM »
VA,

Here's a couple of potential options for you. Please let me know which of these work for you:

Option #1 - is a change to InTeen which "cools" the Search for Roommate advertising making it less attractive to sims in "social need"
Option #2 - is a separate mod which expressly disables autonomous selection of the Search for Roommate behaviour (completely independent of InTeen)

Try the InTeen hotfix first, and if that doesn't work for you, try the mod second.

Best,

J

UPDATE 1/7/18: HotFix removed; please download the full version from the Downloads section.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2018, 10:22:16 AM by jase439 »

Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2018, 03:09:18 AM »
Ok jase, thanks, I'll try those and report back!

Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2018, 03:46:49 AM »
Both packages work for me. I've chosen to keep the no_autonomous_search package in for now.  Thanks.

I can't seem to replicate the jump bug. The family where it happened has dispersed now, unfortunately. No-one else is doing it. But I will look out for it!

« Last Edit: January 02, 2018, 04:12:34 AM by virtualalex »

Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2018, 04:46:29 AM »
Good news. Thanks for testing both. I'll assume this issue has been fully resolved then. If you happen to repeat the jump bug, enable testing cheats, and attach the log to a new thread in the general help forum and we can try to figure out what is the source of that.

Cheers,

J

Offline zephyrzodiac

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2018, 11:27:28 AM »
If I get a sim with a jump bug (no AL, no Inteen) I just delete them - usually clears the problem up, though not always.  Last time I had the problem it was a mod conflict I didn't realise I had, between Mog's desk-locator and Inge's reservable desk etc., so since I prefer the locator to the cheap desk, I just got rid of the desk etc. and no more jumping sims.... until the next time!
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Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2018, 08:30:46 PM »
I found the jump issue - it's got to do with the bunk bed (any bunk bed I think) and the "read to sleep" autonomy, apparently a well known jump bug. Everyone obviously wanted to tend to the child in the (top?) bunk. I downloaded a fix and it seems to have resolved. Probably not related to inteen, it just occurred at a coincidental moment!

Offline BoilingOil

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2018, 09:43:56 PM »
Thank you for keeping us informed, virtualalex. Much appreciated! :)

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Offline jase439

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2018, 01:38:28 PM »
Let me echo that sentiment. +1 for following up on this.

Offline MadamePhobia

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2018, 04:28:52 PM »
I found the jump issue - it's got to do with the bunk bed (...). I downloaded a fix and it seems to have resolved.
Can I ask what fix was this? I don't have Inteen but bunk beds still sometimes randomly give me jump bugs, and I wondered if it might help.

Offline zephyrzodiac

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2018, 04:46:42 PM »
Seconded.  I also have problems with bunk beds flashing blue and have to use the design tool to reset them.
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Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2018, 07:30:46 PM »
@MadamePhobia I googled the error message I kept getting in debug mode (problem executing script "chairsurroundingbed") and got to LittleLittleSimmies page. They had edited a Cyjon hack and so I downloaded their hack, and it seems to have fixed the problem.

http://littlelittlesimmies.tumblr.com/post/135644140480/chairssurroundingbed-error-fix-download

Don't know if I'm supposed to put a link in?

Also, zz, I've had flashing beds too. Don't know if it's related to the above hack (I think it only just started happening...) but it fixes if I go into buy mode, change the colour then change it back to original colour).

[Edit by BoilingOil to consolidate posts]
« Last Edit: February 11, 2018, 06:50:10 AM by BoilingOil »

Offline BoilingOil

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2018, 06:53:21 AM »
Don't know if I'm supposed to put a link in?

Well, someone asked which hack it was. Without giving us a link, that question would've been rather hard to answer. Right?
We don't make so much of a fuss about links, as long as they're appropriate to the context of the board. This one's quite all right!

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2018, 08:54:06 AM »
Just don't like spammers who come along and post links to porn sites!
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Offline virtualalex

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Re: Inteen and "Autonomous Search for Roommate"
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2018, 03:40:50 AM »
Fair enough!!

 

anything
anything